FBI profilers seek psychological clues to Boca mall killer

[darkpassenger91]

Welcome Bluedog i hope you like it herei

i disagree it's unlikely this guy moved away judging from the nature of his crimes he is desperate for money he probably doesn't have the funds to start a new life somewhere else

i also think that the unsub could have some type of physical handicapped the amount of restraints the offender uses to control his victims could be compensation for a physical short coming that could also be the reason that he forces the victim to drive to the ATM instead of doing it himself i also think that could be the reason the unsub started abducting victims with children because he knew that dispite all of the restraints he used if the victim got free he couldn't deal with the struggle
_________________
The criminals make the rules We as profilers are the ones that have to learn them - Criminal Minds
DP91

[BlueDog]

Thank you @toothpick, I am really excited about exchanging ideas here!

Hi @WOLFPACK - I think money may be a component of the crimes, but I don't think it's the main motivating factor behind the crimes. Palm Beach county is by and large a very wealthy area, and the service workers know that. There is a lot of resentment and underlying dislike between the "haves" and the "have-nots"; more than usual because the differences are so much more pronounced. Anyone driving a reasonably expensive car there will have money, this person is targeting a very narrowly defined type of victim.

The time element you mentioned regarding obtaining cash also stands out to me, he takes a LOT of time restraining and binding his victims. He binds them, then binds their necks to the headrest, then slips a pair of covered goggles over their heads. Then repeats the whole process with a terrified and unpredictable child (or vice-versa). He doesn't seem to be concerned about the time element or escape attempts at the riskiest point of the crime - and his victims are secured physically and psychologically at the time the money is withdrawn. A woman bargaining for her child would willingly offer access to any money she could access; no, I think if money was the motivator then he would take the extra 60-90 seconds and withdraw additional amounts from other cards.

If this crime is truly only about the money, then why the ritual? Maybe it's a hybrid evolution - financial gain and retaliation.

I don't think he's into bondage in a socio-sexual sense, but I think he gets some kind of psychological payoff from the visual component of rendering someone powerless. He's definitely some kind of sadist, it's a very sadistic crime from beginning to end.

I think he's very controlled, and he's still in the area. I think he's laying low due to the landslide of media coverage and attention. I have a feeling he's already been on the radar, but was overlooked.

I wonder with a crime of this nature if there could be a dual component - like he commits the robbery-murder then has a sexual release with another unrelated and non-compliant victim. Rapes and assaults are woefully underreported in the Hispanic communities in FL for a number of reasons, immigration status being the main factor. Even though there isn't any sexual contact that we're aware of in the primary crime, I intuitively believe there's a sexual element to it that we can't see yet.

Hi @darkpassenger! I wondered about a physical limitation too. Another possibility is that he's physically slight and small, maybe smaller than the women. A lot of the groundsmen tend to be wiry and small, it's backbreaking work often done in extremely hot and humid circumstances - it's rare to see a robust looking groundskeeper.

There are a lot of wealthy Cuban ex-pats, and well-off Mexican families there - communities in the PB area tend to be very homogenized, and divided along cultural biases. The fact that this man operates outside his cultural base is unusual. A poorly dressed, working-class Hispanic man approaching a well-dressed, well-off Caucasian woman in an upscale shopping center would stand out. It's a high-risk act carried out on a low-risk victim, in a low-risk area. I think that means something...

Anyway - I appreciate the opportunity to kick some ideas around, I look forward to any responses and insights...
_________________
“Every unpunished murder takes away something from the security of every man's life” Daniel Webster

[chrisebeyhoneycutt]

Hi BlueDog!

I think you're right about the connection between the monetary gain and the control/bondage issue.

However, this is one thought I've had: A guy wants to tie up an unwilling partner. That's what gets him going. Problem is, what, is he just going to go around, tieing girls up? That's what "a crazy person would do."

So, how not to be "crazy"? Have a reason for the tying up. What's a good reason? Robbery.

I don't think this is conscious on the robber's behalf. I think his fixation is on the bondage, and he needed to "complete" the fantasy (in other words, give it an ending.) I don't think he thinks to himself "I need an ending to this story," more daydreaming and that's the ending that popped into his head: "I robbed them."

So maybe it's that he wants to tie up an unwilling victim, and to watch them be tied up. So he robs them, to complete the image and the story, and to justify to himself that it isn't the bondage that the thing for him.

Which brings me to the next important point: why cover the goggles, when your victim has already seen you? Maybe you don't want them to see what you're doing next. In other words, maybe you don't want them to see that you're taking pictures of them bound up as you're driving or before you leave.

He might be getting his sex release somewhere else. Doesn't have to be a rape victim, however. It could be a partner of some sort (either a girlfriend, or a wife. Likely with the culture/community he's in that it's a girlfriend [if you live an unstable life, girlfriends tend to be equal to wives, without the formality that might make a person in an unstable existance feel uncomfortable.])

This leads to another thought: why doesn't the FBI ever release a sex profile of these perps so that the wives and girlfriends can go "Uh-oh..."? If carefully phrased, it might lead them to report the perp over covering for them. But my guess is if that guy does have a partner at home, she had a surprisingly energetic evening that night.

I'm not entirely certain that he intended to kill them when he picked them up. I don't know other's thoughts on this. But I wonder if something went wrong, or he didn't know what to do next.

Because the googles could be one of two things: either an MO tactic to avoid being seen, or a signiture in that the victims can't see and are blindfolded. Or both. It's just that shooting the victims seems so psychologically unsatisfying for a guy who likes to tie people up. It's too hands-off. Maybe I'm thinking too far, but the "tie up" guys seem to be the "strangle" guys or the "torture to death" guys, someone who enjoys the pain of dying. Shooting someone is fairly anticlimatic for a bondage freak in my mind.
_________________
Dr. Chris Honeycutt, PhD
Interests: Criminology, terrorism, religious extremism, sexual predators
[Note: degrees in mathematics, biology and geology; just starting psychology]
Profiling is interesting... Crinoids are BORING!

[chrisebeyhoneycutt]

Anybody here speak Spanish?

I had a thought about killings like this one, fantasy and fantasy enactment.

These types - Rader-esque bondage nuts - are deep into fantasy which can be derived from many locations. As Douglas brings up in BTK, it's likely that Rader got his from the bondage imagry in the detective books from 1940-1960/70.

This guy might very well be Cuban or Mexican. Both Cubans and Mexicans still consume massive, massive quantities of "pulp" literature - "novellas," they're called, as are the passonate, pulpy TV shows.

Getting into this guy's head might involve getting into a different culture's head. Might be connected to the surprise ending, although I don't think so. For whatever reason, I think the shooting was MO, not signiture. Just a thought.
_________________
Dr. Chris Honeycutt, PhD
Interests: Criminology, terrorism, religious extremism, sexual predators
[Note: degrees in mathematics, biology and geology; just starting psychology]
Profiling is interesting... Crinoids are BORING!

[darkpassenger91]

i think this guy either has been or will start committing home invasions

thi unsub could have started out burgularizing homes and when he preefected his craft he decided it was time to take the show on the road it is my opinion that the unsub has spent time working in the home of older women he started to see them as easy targets with money in the bank

in my opinion he lives lives with his mother for a number of reasons first because he commits his crimes at the mall which suggests a young offender doesn't have the experience to hit a better establishment

second the meterial used blind the victims was cheap telling me he probably doesn't have the means to buy and store better equipment

third his victims were older women with children they may represent a troubled relationship in the unsub's life this i think could be the reason for the excessive binding

this offender is no into bondage while bound one of the victims complained the rope around her neck was too tight so he cut the tie off if this guy was into bondage it's likely he would have watching the victim choke what he did shows some level of remorse
_________________
The criminals make the rules We as profilers are the ones that have to learn them - Criminal Minds
DP91

[chrisebeyhoneycutt]

[darkpassenger91]

true however in the case of BTK the sexual component was evident but in this case there are no signs of a sexual motivation in neither the physical evidence nor where there aren't any accounts by the victims of either physica; verbal sexual abuse

BTK also enjoyed posing his victims after to death in order to achieve gratification this unsub does not do this

this offender doesn't share the same fantasy

BTK would force his way into his victims house at gun point and tell them he was just going to rob them or he would straightforward and he needed to tie them for sex my point is Rader had a certain level of remorse but at the end of the day you could see the obvious sexual narture in his crimes

i'm not saying this guy doesn't employ his bondage fantasies in his regular sex life but i highly doubt that as the motivation for these crimes

if it were me i'd focus on students who attend the nearby FLA campus we know one thing for sure he's not black due to the fact that he repeatedly told one of the women to describe him to the investigators as fat black guy
_________________
The criminals make the rules We as profilers are the ones that have to learn them - Criminal Minds
DP91

[chrisebeyhoneycutt]

Yes, but what if the Boca Raton guy doesn't realize he's doing it for the sexual satisfaction, that his crimes are sexually motivated?

Offenders often don't know why they do things. In this guy's case, he may have no serious clue that the reason he wants to commit these robberies is for sexual satisfaction. I still hold that he might be Cuban or Mexican, and that he might be fixated on "robber fantasies" for a sexual reason, but because the literature doesn't contain the implied or overt sexual element, he might feel perfectly comfortable with the idea that "I'm just like ____, a robber."

Once again, I think consuming the literature and TV he might consume may be important for understanding his behavior. This is obviously a fantasy-driven crime, but how the perp defines these fantasies is probably driven by whatever fantasy-generating material he consumes.
_________________
Dr. Chris Honeycutt, PhD
Interests: Criminology, terrorism, religious extremism, sexual predators
[Note: degrees in mathematics, biology and geology; just starting psychology]
Profiling is interesting... Crinoids are BORING!

[darkpassenger91]

have you read about or looked into any sexual assaualts in that area in which the victims were bound in a similar manner?
_________________
The criminals make the rules We as profilers are the ones that have to learn them - Criminal Minds
DP91

[WOLFPACK]

since some of you guys obvioulsy think the perp is a bondage guy or some sort based upon that.
I don't see it though.

I still believe he was only interested in robbing the victims and bondage was just to insure he was in control of them.

I do hope they have his dna or fingerprints..I don't recall seeing any claim that they have either of those.If they don't..it will be unlikely it will be solved unless the guy spills the beans to someone.

[darkpassenger91]

dna and fingerprints were taken from the scene and judging by what we know about this offender i would say he left some type of physical evidence behind
_________________
The criminals make the rules We as profilers are the ones that have to learn them - Criminal Minds
DP91

[BlueDog]

Hi, chrisebeyhoneycutt! I agree with so much of what you said, and I'm so happy to interact with so many who share my interest!

After reading through some of the comments, I realized there were aspects of the case that I was a little fuzzy on, mainly due to so much time having passed. I found an article that focused much more heavily on the surviving victim, and realized that was probably a great place to break everything down. I was surprised at some of what I read, and I think you guys might be too.

I was wrong when I made the assumption that the surviving victims (Jane Doe, her son) were first. They were the second set of victims.

The chronology goes:

1) 3/23/07 Randi Gorenberg - Age 53 ATM w/d unknown, credit cards stolen
2) 8/7/07 Jane Doe - Age 30, 2 y/o son/Carjacked at SW end of the mall $200 ATM withdrawal
3) 12/13/07 Nancy Bochicchio - Age 47, 7 y/o daughter/Carjacked at SW end of the mall $500 ATM withdrawal

All the women were slim, and had medium length brown hair. All drove black SUV's. Gorenberg and Bochicchio both attempted to escape; Jane Doe didn't try to escape but did plead for her life and may have had less access to money. Gorenberg didn't have a child with her.

Credit cards stolen from Randi Gorenberg were used in Massachusetts and Connecticut on August 12, 2008. Authorities say her credit cards were used in August, by two men, in the following places:

-At 1:02, two Playstation games were purchased from Sears in the Holyoke Mall.
-At 1:22, fast food was purchased down the road from the mall in West Springfield, MA
-At 2:20 a Playstation 3 was purchased at Toys 'R Us in Newington, CT


Suspect description:

The man in the composite is said to be a white man with a good tan, or Hispanic man, between the ages of 18 and 25. Police say he is between 5 feet 10 inches and 6 feet tall with a medium build. They also think he could have a ponytail.

From an interview given to AMW by Jane Doe:


She walks to her car, places her son in the car seat and sets the bags in the back seat, then walks around to the back and opens the tailgate, and puts in the stroller. She walks around to the front, and notices a man is in the car. He tells her to get in, she's in shock, he tells her again to get in and at that point she notices he has a gun. She gets in.

He tells her to drive to a bank, at this point she is scared because she thought he would just take her money and cards and leave, and now she realizes he is taking her with him.

When they get to the ATM, she checks her balance and he tells her to withdraw $200. The police report said it was $600, in her interview she states it was $200.

After she withdraws the money, she asks if they are going to back to the mall and he tells her to just drive. She says, "You said we would go back to the mall", and he again says, "Just drive."

As she drives he asks her what road they are on, and she says she doesn't know because she isn't familiar with the area and she's nervous. She keeps driving and driving, and he asks if there's a church in the area, she again says she doesn't know. He says he must have been thinking of somewhere else. They pull into a parking lot; the police report states it was a church parking lot.

He places her in the backseat of the car. He has a plastic bag with him, and at this point he reaches in and pulls out handcuffs. She starts crying, and then he handcuffs her as tightly as they will go, then pulls out a big bag of zip-ties. He ties her ankles together, and then ties her neck tightly to the headrest.

When he doesn't take her jewelry, which included an expensive watch and a diamond bracelet she thinks he is going to kill them. She starts crying and begging, she can't move her head. He removes her sunglasses, and then pulls out another pair of (fake Gucci) sunglasses from the bag. This pair is blacked out with tape. He then places the sunglasses on her face, covering her eyes. Later he replaces the sunglasses with blacked-out swimming goggles.

He tells her they are going back to the mall, and starts to drive out. Before they are even out of the parking lot she starts to panic, screaming, crying and choking - telling him she can't breathe. She thinks he is going to take her to a house and rape and murder her.

He drives back to the mall, leaves her in the car and the car running; he tells her if she calls the police he will come back for her.


This interview changes a lot of my perceptions about this crime. To begin with, I have doubts about Randi Gorenberg being part of the pattern. If she is, then I think she was definitely his first victim so he's new at this.

I really think there is a sexual component to this series of crimes, but it isn't a straightforward one. He seems to need absolute compliance, and any show of resistance escalates into murder immediately. Looking for a church parking lot is interesting, and the fact that he didn't know where they were indicates he doesn't have access to a vehicle on a regular basis.

I don't think he is into B&D/S&M, but I do think there is more to the binding and blinding than just expediency. He spends too much time on it, and it's too planned out not to have an emotional or psychological component attached to it.

From what Jane Doe interviews; he doesn't engage verbally beyond necessary communication, doesn't seem nervous, and seems very much in control. There is no urgency to what he's doing which tells me he's enjoying it, and the money is part of the cycle but he's enacting most of the activity after the money is in hand. So the restraints are less about compliance and more about his need for control. This is all about posing and visualizing, like Harvey Carnigan, IMO.

Not sure about hyperlink etiquette, but I have them as references to the above post.
_________________
“Every unpunished murder takes away something from the security of every man's life” Daniel Webster

[darkpassenger91]

Clothing Store Massacre Leaves 5 Dead


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Detectives say this man killed five women and injured another in a brutal mass murder at a women's clothing store in a Chicago suburb.

On Feb. 2, 2008, a man posing as a delivery man walked in to the Lane Bryant clothing store in Tinley Park, Ill. The sole surviving eyewitness told cops that the man quickly pulled out a gun and the situation escalated within minutes.

Police say the five victims were all women. They were found inside the store, bound with clothing and duct tape and shot execution-style in the head. A sixth woman was shot in the neck and miraculously survived.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------



They were found inside the store, bound with clothing and duct tape and shot, execution-style, in the head.

The biggest clue?


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This could be the best clue to the killer's identification. An eyewitness told cops that she saw the killer had a braid over his right ear. The end of the braid had four light-green beads on the end. A police sketch artist incorporated those clues into this rendering.

AMW took surveillance video from the parking lot of the shopping center where the killings happened to the leading expert on video enhancement Dr. David Hathaway of NASA. Dr. Hathaway and AMW correspondent Jon Leiberman found two mysterious vehicles on the tape.

At 10:39 a.m., shortly before the 911 call is made from inside the store, a van or SUV arrives in front of the store and parks head-on directly in front of the door. At 10:40 a.m., another car arrives and parks nearby. What's more, at 10:45 a.m., that vehicle leaves, and less than a minute later, the other vehicle departs. The vehicles leave right around the same time police believe the killer would be leaving the area. Now, police are hoping to use these grainy images to help identify the vehicles. Cops think the vehicles at the very least contain witnesses to the crime, and could even be linked to the killer.

»See The Surveillance Photos


Victims Mourned As A Community Searches for Answers

An entire community continues to mourn the five victims and search for answers. Police called on area pastors to reach out to their congregations for any information people may have about the killings. Inside the Full Gospel Christian Assemblies Church, Apostle Ron Wilson is calling on his congregants to throw out the "stop snitching" mantra and help police find this brutal killer. He says the murders of Connie Woolfolk, Sarah T. Szafranski, Carrie Chiuso, Rhoda McFarland and Jennifer Bishop must be solved.

»Hear Pastor Ron Wilson's Message

A $55,000 reward -- most of which is being paid for by Lane Bryant's parent company, Charming Shoppes Inc. -- is being offered for information leading to the suspect's arrest. In fact, Lane Bryant has also established the "Lane Bryant Tinley Park Memorial Fund" to honor the lives and memories of the five victims. The fund will be used to provide financial assistance to the immediate families of the victims.


Wanted For:
Murder (5 counts) , Tinley Park , IL ; Feb 02, 2008
(Information valid as of May 14, 2010)
_________________
The criminals make the rules We as profilers are the ones that have to learn them - Criminal Minds
DP91

[BlueDog]

They look like they are motorcycle touring goggles. The guy might ride a motorcycle, live with someone who does, or hang out in biker bars. They range in price from $12.00 all the way up to $100's. I wonder if anyone checked to see if they are prescription lenses...
_________________
“Every unpunished murder takes away something from the security of every man's life” Daniel Webster

[darkpassenger91]

that's a great deduction bluedog that would explain why the victim's described the goggles as tinted
_________________
The criminals make the rules We as profilers are the ones that have to learn them - Criminal Minds
DP91